blazer1504

25th April 2003 13:05 UTC

AVS problem (?) with new comps
I got my 2,4 ghz p4 (with 512 mb ddr 333) last week and AVS runs really weird with this. AVS presets tends to run exactly with 32 or 64 fps. For example if the fps is, let's say, 55fps in the very beginning, after a few seconds it jumps to 64fps. I can't get fps any higher that 64 fps no matter how simple & how small screen I have. What is even weirder is that the speed is not so debendful from screen size. For example NemoOrange's Pepsi preset runs with 32fps with 320x240 screen, and when I enlarged the screen to 360x280 it ran with same fps !! I don't think it's the fps counter what is "broken" because it seemed to ran as smoothly as with the smaller screen size. First I thought it was the winamp version what caused it (I was using Wa2.77 then) but when updated to 2.81 & 3 same problem with them.....And yes, I have 'wait for retrace' disabled..

UnConeD

25th April 2003 14:31 UTC

It's the FPS counter which is broken for fast speeds. Over here it snaps at integer divisions of 100 sometimes (25, 33, 50, 99.9).

Did you bother looking at the presets to see if they actually do suddenly go slower, or are you just one of those FPS freaks? :D

Shouldn't be a problem to make a better FPS detector as an APE, but really, who cares? :)

Rovastar

25th April 2003 17:50 UTC

Come on you gotta be a fps freak. :);)

dirkdeftly

25th April 2003 21:15 UTC

*says the milkdropper*

UnConeD

26th April 2003 00:05 UTC

I don't care about FPS, I care whether or not a preset looks and moves smoothly. You can make smooth 15FPS presets, or crappy 25FPS presets.

Raz

26th April 2003 00:20 UTC

15 FPS presets in relation to what?

anubis2003

26th April 2003 02:02 UTC

FPS isn't relative. What does your question mean raz?

Raz

26th April 2003 03:24 UTC

what my question originally meant was on what computer because a 25 fps preset may be 15 on another, when i reread it i realised it didn't make much sense. Never mind.

blazer1504

26th April 2003 08:28 UTC

Well, yeah, I don't really watch the fps rate to brag with it, but now it's very hard to say is the preset fast or not because the fps counter shows what it shows & every preset works smoootly with this anyway ;)

...ofcourse I still have that 550mhz comp :blah:

unripeLemon

27th April 2003 14:08 UTC

Raz, fps on your computer cant compare with a normal comuter. You can't really talk about slow fps rate because it doesn't exist on your computer(considering the sheer size and slowness of 'glass cubes, it took bill gates to make it a tiny bit faster;)how the hell did you make it:D).

Shock Value

28th April 2003 03:58 UTC

I have the exact same problem as blazer. It gravitates toward 32 and 64, and NEVER goes above 64. I'm pretty sure it's not just the counter, too. For example, I tried a blank preset with a n=20 superscope running a simple spin, and it actually did run faster on my older computer, as well as reading about 280fps on the old and only 64 on the new. Of course, on more complex presets my new computer does way better than my old. The only time my new computer ever ran above this limit, though, was once when I was fooling with the render thread priority. The odd thing was that it ran this way when it was set on idle. However, after closing Winamp and reopening, the problem was back and fooling with any of the display options didn't help. Of course, I'm not complaining here, but it is an odd glitch that I'd like to fix. Oh, and by the way, this glitch occurs on both Winamp 2.91 and 3.

Here are some stats...

Old computer:
400Mhz Gateway
64MB Ram
a really old ATI Rage card, I think 2mb video memory
a really old Creative sound card, not sure exactly which

New:
2.4Ghz Dell
512MB Ram
ATI Radeon 9700, 128MB video memory
Creative Audigy 2

Anyone else who has had this problem, please post your computer specs to see if we have anything in common that might be the source of the problem.

Thanks in advance.

Tuggummi

28th April 2003 06:57 UTC

Hmm... could it be an Intel Inside problem? :D
I have an athlon XP +2100 and i don't have such problems.

Of course if you use wait for retrace it always tends to sync the fps to the refresh rate of your monitor, but i guess this isn't the issue here.

All in all, totally weird, but i expect it to be hardware based and even more it's just your cpu's fault.

dirkdeftly

28th April 2003 20:03 UTC

...turn of wait for retrace? :igor:
note that this will cause problems with the oscs going so fast that they get the same sample multiple times; try putting an oscilloscope star in there at >64 fps. you'll see 'echoes'...

Shock Value

28th April 2003 22:32 UTC

I always leave Wait For Retrace off, so that's definitely not the problem. But it doesn't really bother me much, so don't worry about it. Though, if you have a solution, please post it.

UnConeD

29th April 2003 00:12 UTC

Try this... it measures the time between render() calls, so this is the actual amount of frames being drawn per second.

UnConeD

29th April 2003 00:13 UTC

Damn forgot to zip it, and it seems that when you post an APE file (which is not allowed here), it just skips the attachment.

Shock Value

29th April 2003 03:57 UTC

Thanks for the file, UnConeD. I ran the APE and got 64.2562 with a preset containing only a Render/Simple. And one other thing, it also gravitates towards 16fps, as well as 32 and 64. I suspect it's like that for all powers of two, but it's hard to test the smaller ones.

UnConeD

29th April 2003 18:40 UTC

It might have something to do with your graphics drivers, in any case it's not AVS' fault...

shreyas_potnis

1st May 2003 12:28 UTC

well, this happens on my comp...
when there is only one ssc in an avs file, the AVS preset runs faster in 640X480@16 pixel doubling off than with pixel doubling off.

pixel doubling on: fps less by 2 to 3

UnConeD

1st May 2003 18:25 UTC

Shreyas: pixeldoubling itself is not free. It's perfectly possible that for really basic presets with resolution-independent effects (such as a lowpoint scope), the non-doubled version is faster than the doubled version.

Shock Value

8th May 2003 04:11 UTC

I think I just discovered something extremely important to solving this problem. When I open Kazaa Lite and click into the theater window, the problem seems to just go away until I close Kazaa. The frame rate just returns to regular levels (64fps+) as if there never was a problem. Once Kazaa Lite is closed, however, the frame rate drops back to 32fps or 64fps. I have tried this method repeatly and every time it works, I should add. Anyone else with this problem, I encourage you to try this to see if it works. And if anyone knows how or why this works, or knows of a better solution, please post.

Some quick stats...

Wait for retrace... no.
Pixel doubling... no.
Highest frame rate setting.
Both suppress checks checked.
No alpha blending.
No overlay mode or set desktop to color.
Normal render thread priority.

As far as the seriousness of this problem goes, it doesn't really bother me when watching presets, but it is troublesome when making them. It's difficult to see exactly how the presets would look at different frame rates. I'm glad I have at least a quick and dirty solution for the time being.

And finally, something I found odd... When I use UnConeD's FPS counter with Kazaa open, it reads "1.#INF". Once I close Kazaa and reload the APE, it functions normally. Hopefully UnConeD can explain this.

Magic.X

8th May 2003 07:49 UTC

This sounds even weirder.

Could this depend on the OS and multithreading?

Shock Value

11th May 2003 18:21 UTC

OK, right now it started running normally (64fps+) and Kazaa hasn't been open since before a restart. The only two programs open are IE and Winamp (confirmed by CTRL+ALT+DELETE). Even when I close and reopen Winamp, the frame rates are still above 64. The only change I've made to the system recently is a driver update to the Audigy 2 sound card.

Limpet

12th May 2003 02:59 UTC

I have the same pc config as blazer and the same avs settings as shock value, but dont have the same problem. i have about 80.3 fps in a window size at 320x230.

Limpet

12th May 2003 21:14 UTC

On simple single superscope preset i can get over 200 fps. Thats in winamp 3 with avs v 2.5.1

WHCode RED

28th May 2003 18:44 UTC

With that FPS Counter APE I get a real readin for 5 secs then its 1.#INF

unripeLemon

28th May 2003 20:38 UTC

Hmm,code red, it seems you like mountain dew:D I never advertise anything thnk you very much!

UnConeD

28th May 2003 21:41 UTC

Btw I recently found out about QueryPerformanceCounter() which is a Win32 function for a high-resolution timer, with an accuracy of about 5-10 µs (not a typo). If I change the ape to use that, it still reports 33.3333 FPS here ;).

Zevensoft

2nd June 2003 15:24 UTC

Blank Preset.
200fps with the AVS window covered. (320x240x32)
120fps with the AVS window visible. (320x240x32)

Both FPS were flucuating with 1 decimal point accuracy.

Windows 98SE, Pentium III 733Mhz, 640MB SDRAM, 128MB DDR ATi Radeon 9100 @ 1280x1024x32.