thepyr0x

27th March 2003 03:56 UTC

AVS that annoys me
*RANT THREAD*
in hopes of making future preset releases better, I'm going to put all of the things in AVS that piss me off.

1. Installers that restart my winamp and change my settings. I cannot say how much this annoys me. At least include a fucking option if you're going to put this into your installers
2. Presets that do nothing in relation to the music. Sure, they look pretty, and they may be pretty trippy, but if I cannot tell the difference between the near silent parts of a song and the wailing of guitars, I don't like your presets. (ie. dragontooth, or dragon's teeth, or something similar)
3. Presets that are boring. Easy enough said. I enjoy watching, say, El-Vis's Molehole...but I really can't stand soiamrebornagain's oceanscene
4. Metablobs. Nothing is more boring than seeing a few blobs dance around the screen. The worst part is, almost all of the metablob-inclusive presets are just metablobs + some color effects + blur....boooorrrring
5. That ball/globe effect (see Tugunami's [yes I know I spelt it wrong] Club Seizure) that seems so very trendy (and repetitive) lately.

I think that pretty much sums my complaints up. I'm sure other people will come here and give their bitchings as well

anubis2003

27th March 2003 04:15 UTC

1. Definitely true. Whyeye.org rings a bell. They have some good presets, but their installers are very annoying.
2. I also agree. AVS is only different from many animation programs in that it isn't static and reacts to music.
3. Who would want something boring? Some people would consider presets boring that others would find interesting - Atero's life algorithms for instance. I love them, but I think some people wouldn't find them too interesting.
4. Metablobs are sweet if done well. Now Moving Particles are almost always terrible.
5. I think I know what you are talking about. It can be done well, but it isn't very often as are many similar effects.

Also, I don't like overusage of blurs, or presets that have so many colors with no blurring in between them and look randomly colored.

Let's try to keep this thread from turning into a flame thread, shall we?

dirkdeftly

27th March 2003 05:09 UTC

1: Gods yes, that's the most annoying fucking thing I've ever seen. Whoever invented that little "technique" should be shot :mad:
2: AVS is there as a vis, but also there as an animation program and a challenge for some people (e.g. me) - as long as you deliberately say "EYE CANDY - blablabla" it's fine, but if you pass something totally and deliberately unreactive off as a visualization, it's irritating to the user.
3: See 2. If it looks good, it doesn't matter. Also, different presets are geared for different types of music. And...MY LIFE ALGORITHMS ROCK. 'nuff said.
4: Metablobs ARE sweet if done well, but they hardly ever are - especially if it's some n00b using UnConeD's APE for the helluvit. Moving Particles are almost always great, except for the classic "moving particle+water+blitter feedback=DISCO PARTY!!!1"-style presets.
5: That's a taste thing, not a trend thing. Now when you do it over and over and over again and the presets don't have variety, it's really annoying, but if you can make it look good, more power too ya.

in other words...f00k j00 j00 cl0s3d m1nd3d p00 ;)

Tuggummi

27th March 2003 06:12 UTC

1) Yes i agree.

2) Well i agree 75% , but a small part of me wants to do sometimes presets that only look good. But in the end im against it. Presets should visualize music and i hate myself when my presets don't do that.

3) Well it is everyones personal opinion what ever is boring or not, i happen to like the pack So I am Reborn Again and i also like El-vis.

4) Well haven't done any of them yet myself, but there is quite a lot of metablob presets around. The worst metablob presets are that use UnConeD's Metablobs 3D APE (except UnConeD himself, because he coded it)

5) I agree with Atero, it's not a trend thing it's a taste thing. I happen to like them, they make excellent disco presets :blah:



Even though it's a rant thread you shouldn't attack single people or packs, because that can result in an ugly flamewar/bannings & no one especially the author feels good about it.

Magic.X

27th March 2003 09:28 UTC

I agree to 1.) but to nothing else because that is artificial individuality.

And let me say one more thing considering APE use: published APE's exist to be used! They give credits through the config screen and so what?

I'm AVS'ing to create good looking Presets. If i'd like to use tentacles 3d for example, why shouldnt i? Just because some guys say its noobish and shit? :mad:

I like the effect and i'm not gonna recode it just to have the same effect, but done by myself.

As i tould that i wouldnt use others Presets in my VJ-Set,all said i should do.

Now as i'm using APE's all sai i'd better do this myself. This is just mad.

To those guys who think that way: You hav'nt coded AVS, you'd better create your own!

Tuggummi

27th March 2003 09:52 UTC

Well it is a rant thread so i rant that using those APE's is pretty much always a bad thing to do. One thing is that you can't much control it in anyway other than color. Second thing is that they are really heavy effects & when people add a loads of effect among with them the presets work always really slow. Also using mirror with these APE's isn't wise since they look really stupid then.

And basicly it's just n00bish and we all want to be 1337 :p

Why it's n00bish? Well you have to ask that from all the people who use them in a n00bish way... and there is quite a lot of them. :mad:

Magic.X

27th March 2003 10:23 UTC

Originally posted by Tuggummi
One thing is that you can't much control it in anyway other than color.

Originally posted by Tuggummi
Second thing is that they are really heavy effects & when people add a loads of effect among with them the presets work always really slow.

Originally posted by Tuggummi
Also using mirror with these APE's isn't wise since they look really stupid then.

Originally posted by Tuggummi
And basicly it's just n00bish and we all want to be 1337 :p

Why it's n00bish? Well you have to ask that from all the people who use them in a n00bish way... and there is quite a lot of them. :mad:

Tuggummi

27th March 2003 10:54 UTC

Why do you think there are DM's???

As this is a rant thread, i would rant that your PC is just damn slow

anubis2003

27th March 2003 12:08 UTC

They do need to add a dynamic color thing - it could have some really nice results with some nice colored lens effects, and it would be really easy to do.

Raz

27th March 2003 13:42 UTC

Go ahead and use the tentacles APE, the only reason it's considered noob and not good is that most noobs use it, meaning everyone has seen the effect again and again and is sick to shit of looking at it.

Yathosho

27th March 2003 13:48 UTC

Originally posted by Magic.X
If i'd like to use tentacles 3d for example, why shouldnt i? Just because some guys say its noobish and shit?

Originally posted by anubis2003
1. Definitely true. Whyeye.org rings a bell. They have some good presets, but their installers are very annoying.

Magic.X

27th March 2003 13:58 UTC

Originally posted by Raz_001
everyone has seen the effect again and again and is sick to shit of looking at it.

Raz

27th March 2003 15:11 UTC

yeah but ring is awful and noob and people are sick of looking at that too.

dirkdeftly

27th March 2003 20:01 UTC

Okay, anyone that DOES want to use UnConeD's two 3D APEs, remember: THEY WERE CREATED AS PRESETS IN AND OF THEMSELVES. It's like taking El-Vis's Sentinel, changing the trans effcts and calling it your own. You can't control their movement, you can't control the camera positions (using a DM on them just makes them look warped), you can't do anything with them. Why use the APEs? Make your own goddamned effect instead. It's the same objection I have to people using El-Vis's 3D code: it's stealing others' work. I for one would be really fucking pissed of someone stole my Life algorithm and passed it off as their own. If you want to make your own Metablobs effect, or your own Tentacles effect, that's fine, but don't rip off UnConeD's hard work. It's rude, and it's lazy, and it's an insult to the original author.

Hmm, somehow that sounds like the very definition of "n00b" to me....

anubis2003

27th March 2003 20:44 UTC

Wouldn't ripping his idea of making a tentacles preset be the same? Stealing someone's ideas is just as bad as stealing parts of their presets. I try to make original things(or at least things that haven't been done before), and I think I have made some original presets. I try to stay away from doing anything that has been done before(i.e. 2 planes presets, etc.) and make new stuff that is interesting as well. There are many people who don't try to do either - these are, IMO, the worst AVSers out there.

Raz

27th March 2003 20:57 UTC

not necessarily. Doing half good presets that people have done before is kind of a transition intomaking better DM's and scopes, it's just the limit of what they can do.

anubis2003

27th March 2003 21:00 UTC

Doing them to learn is fine, but they shouldn't be released as their own, unless they at least have more than 50% of it being their own work. I have made many presets that are almost identical to other people's presets so that I could understand them better, but I don't release them, because I would feel bad taking credit for them. Their are still basic things that can be made that haven't been made before.

shreyas_potnis

28th March 2003 05:28 UTC

i agree with the first complaint, and that is all

Magic.X

28th March 2003 06:30 UTC

Omg, now its about stealing ideas?!

You know how many presets have been released? And there still shall be something that hasnt been done? I dont believe in that.

Anyway what oughta i to do when making avs? Get an idea and then search the forums wheter it has been done before because i could 'steal' it? This is insane and goes some steps too far.

Shall i get my ideas patented now???

Back to the Ape thing, how can i sell it as my own when the blue script says created by UnConed or whatever?
I don't think its bad using APE' but someones scopes or DM's.

Furthermore, what considers specially me, i neither release Presets nor have i ever, except some, that i published only in the forums.

I do presets to have fun with it. If i enjoy them i'll do VJ'ing with them otherwise they will be delted sooner or later.

http://www.htwm.de/mkrause1/polymorp...e_megaphon.gif I'M NOT AVSING TO GET HONORED BY ANYONE OR TO BE CONSIDERED AS COOL, GODDAMN!

dirkdeftly

28th March 2003 07:08 UTC

Not when the ideas are age-old effects, like metablobs or "tentacles" (if that's even the real name for the effect). Hell, the idea for the preview from TFF2.0 was stolen :)

blazer1504

28th March 2003 08:20 UTC

1. That really doesn't annoy me, what really annoys me in the installers is the n00bish detection. I hate installers where you have to type/browse instdir by yourself and it still goes to somewhere like .../plugins/avs/program files/winamp... that is annoying as hell !

2.I like presets that looks original if they don't have too much beatdetection but looks very original & sweet it doesn't really bother me.

3.Boring presets are bad, I agree !

4.Some metaballs presets looks cool some doesn't

5. see above..

Montana

28th March 2003 11:46 UTC

1. i agree, that's why i only use pimp (i'm gonna use nsis for next pack, but that's just for the w2/w3 thing)
2. some people need eyecandy
3. i'm gonna say like many others has said, that's just a matter of taste
4. see #3
5. see #3

i'm kinda late in this arguement but here's the thing, don't bitch at the whole avs scene, some of us just do it for ourselves and if others like it, then why not.

Phaze1987

28th March 2003 21:00 UTC

Well i hate anything that screws winamp or doesnt work or sweares me.Nice sig thepyr0x.Oh and the ball effect is nice !

mikm

28th March 2003 21:47 UTC

1: These are very annoying. What I hate worse are people who don't NSIS their things. Many n00b packs are unregistered WinZip Self-Extractor files. I especially hate those that set the default directory to my temporary folder, so I have no clue as to what folder I extract to.

2: I disagree with this one. UnConeD has made some awesome presets that aren't music-reactive.

3: Of course

4: Depends on how well they are done. If it is NOT UnConeD's APE, but their own hard work, then it is a little better

5: see #4

I can't stand people that release about three or four packs at once, with no improvement among them. I also can't stand people that take other's work and change one thing then post it as their own, yet nobody recognizes it as a rip. HalfL AVS

NemoOrange

31st March 2003 03:00 UTC

Werd, boring presets are a pain in the ass, but as far as my "Oceanscene" goes, what you call boring, I call smooth.

One thing that pisses me off is hyper active visualizations, with too many colors, too fast movements, & just too much of everything. Personally, I was very happy with "Oceanscene" because I could watch it while I listened to some chill music. On top of that, it was a pretty innovative visualization, I've yet to see anyone attempt to come close to such a vision.

& Moving Particles are one of the best renders in my opinion.

dif'rent strokes for dif'rent folks.

thepyr0x

1st April 2003 01:43 UTC

*finally has a response*

as far as metablobs go, I did find one (although I don't remember what the name is) metablobs preset that was really pretty sweet, because you didn't know it was metablobs unless you really payed attention. that whole 3d thing just....looked....bad on any of the presets I downloaded....

to Nemo - I'm not going to say oceanscene was unoriginal or even bad; but I much prefer presets that can adapt to any kind of music...like...ones where if you're listening to a quieter slower music you can see a huge difference from the loud, pumping, fast music; and both look good....

fsk

1st April 2003 08:19 UTC

1. I agree:), this sucks

1. That really doesn't annoy me, what really annoys me in the installers is the n00bish detection. I hate installers where you have to type/browse instdir by yourself and it still goes to somewhere like .../plugins/avs/program files/winamp... that is annoying as hell !

Magic.X

1st April 2003 09:47 UTC

Originally posted by fsk
AVS IS ABOUT VISUALS NOT CODE

thepyr0x

2nd April 2003 03:22 UTC

lol whoops
sorry fsk
I coulda sworn that one was his.....oh well, I only watch avs when I'm falling asleep so that definately could explain it...